Arsène Wenger


#9410

We won more in Europe pre Wenger.

As has been mentioned, it was a different era - most footballers weren’t celebrities in the old days. But we had some fantastic players pre Wenger who I have no doubt would have been known by some outside of England.

And actually, one example would be Juventus buying Liam Brady from us. I remember reading Brady say he was shocked that there were so fans waiting for him at the airport in Turin.


#9411

Oh Ian…


#9412

Arsenal should hire a shit British manager part 7

The previous editions include Rodgers, Howe, Monk and Owen fucking Coyle!


#9413

This simply isn’t true.
I’ve been to Highbury in the 70’s and 80’s and there have been crowds of more than 50k and 60k.
In the late 80’s I went to at least four games in the same season where the attendance was more than 50k.
There was no advertising, no live football, apart from the FA Cup final and no foreign imports, people went because they loved it.

It seems people who weren’t going to games then just don’t understand how popular football was and how big we were.
I can’t think of many clubs bigger or more well respected than us then.


#9414

Last year it was Eddie Howe’s turn, considering they are now a rabble I suppose this makes sense.


#9415

Preach girl!


#9416

I’m glad someone who actually went to games during this period has finally pointed this out, it was getting ridiculous reading people who started following Arsenal 10 years ago thinking they could transport themselves to the pre-internet era and evaluate how big the club was. :laughing:


#9417

Croud sizes conspired then compared to now are irrelivent, since back then it was all standing and now their is a finite number of seats and that’s it

Everton thotenham Newcastle West Ham etc would have regularly had crowds just as big back then it’s a mute point


#9418

The reason I bought this point up was in reply to @Trion who said "football wasn’t so popular in the 80’s and 90’s.
It was as popular as it is now but without the vast commercialism and opportunity to see every match on TV.


#9419

Nope I’m afraid that’s not accurate Kaner. Arsenal have been amongst the country’s biggest since Herbert Chapman put us there in the early 1930s. The difference now that English football has gone international is simply that the discrepancy between ‘big’, ‘bigger’, ‘biggest’ etc is that much clearer to see


#9420

Maybe but again theirs no way of knowing

I’d say their is a good chance that if football was still watched from terraces and all standing and clubs just crammed in as many as possible like they used to every club in the premier league would break any attendance record going but who knows


#9421

ACording to wiki Man City vs stoke had 80k+ in the 30’s

As I say croud sizes back in the days of standing terraces has no real bearing on how big a club is/was


#9422

Yes it does, because with football not having international reach and television not being what it is today, the number of physical attendees to a game coming from a club’s local area would’ve been a direct reflection of a club’s size.


#9423

But if stadiums were crammed full people standing and no upper limit of people that are allowed into the stadium now I think it’s safe to say all attendance records would very quickly be broken

Your compairing apples to oranges


#9424

Ok well I’ll leave it at that then. For me it’s fairly clear that historical attendance is a solid index of club size in the pre-money, pre-internationalisation era of the game, along with the trophy cabinet. I mean, it’s plain as day to me. Both indices putting us at the top table of clubs from the 1930s onwards with a smattering of other clubs that all enjoyed peaks and troughs over the years. But that top table appears more of a level playing field than we see today, where the haves and have nots are miles apart


#9425

If you just look at statistics and don’t consider mitigating factors you will constantly come to the wrong conclusion, I’m not surprised it’s clear as day to you if that’s your approach but that dosent make you any less wrong

Can you post he list of historical attendance records your getting you info if you’ve got a minute please


#9426

Exactly. Some people think we were a middle table team before Wenger.


#9427

Nobody thinks that


#9428

So you can’t evaluate the past unless you were alive and present at the very moment you want to discuss?

A tad archaic don’t you think?


#9429

You’re talking about historically greatness. Historically Liverpool is still number 1 and Chelsea and City are historically lower table nobodies. Everton, Leeds and Newcastle are historically all bigger than those 2. But today Liverpool with the most history are probably the 5th most attractive English team, maybe 6th.

If Wenger had gone to Newcastle and brought in the best of Europe’s talents, given them 3 PL titles and 7 FA Cups and gave them consistent CL football they’d be considered a huge club today. He’ll always be a huge part of our history and we were lucky to have him.

It’s interesting thinking back though. Because today you accept who the top 6 will be at the start of the season and usually you’ll be right. But back then Leeds and Blackburn could get promoted and win the title in a couple of seasons. Back in the 70s and 80s many English teams won European trophies. Now you know it’ll be between 3 super teams.

Football’s been ruined.