We are who we are still, even on a new site 
So did we get him in the end? :bellerin:
Last I heard was it could be done by end of tomorrow.
It’s not only on the manager, but it does go a ways toward disproving the narrative that Wenger is a wizard at exploding young talents.
It’s also something of a chicken and egg argument as to whether they are ‘intrinsically’ intelligent players or their lack of intelligence is a byproduct of the environment they’ve been raised in. Ramsey has shown intelligence in limited periods of time, for example (though never really combined tactical discipline/intelligence with top quality, so it may be that one comes at the expense of the other–tbh I don’t think Ramsey would’ve been a top player under even Pep, he just would’ve been offloaded sooner/not invested in so much). Wilshere is obviously something of an idiot and a real lad, but that hasn’t stopped Arturo Vidal from becoming a top player, or a million other top footballers, either.
On the cases of Ox, Gibbs, Theo, Djourou, potentially Chambers, Gnabry, it’s hard to say, like I say it’s a chicken and egg thing when you start trying to figure out how much is down to just the player ultimately not being good enough/how much is down to the development of his talent, but it’s hard to deny the overall sensation that more could’ve been got out of this group as a whole.
This guy looks really good.
You mentioned us winning the league in the same breath as Conte and Pep. So what’s a realistic “recipe” for Arsenal to win the title in your estimation?
We needed a CB signing and I’m not at all surprised to see us go for a younger player. Not somebody who will disrupt the first team immediately (although I hope he does this obviously) and signals that Mertesacker has at least a season more left at Arsenal.
I’m still not convinced who should partner Koscielny but it’s comforting to have Chambers and now Holding as decent prospects to potentially grow into important first team starters.
But who does? That’s my point. At least Arsenal develops a core of useful players, even if lately none of them have turned out to be world class. In that respect, Arsenal does as well as any of the clubs that fill the Champions League spots in the top leagues. The English clubs who are good at developing young players and who then rely on them (Southampton or West Ham, for instance) usually then sell them on to better clubs when they can make a big profit.
that’s why I put it on a lack of judgement more than it is on development. Obviously you can make the argument that not getting more out of the current group is a failure, but at the same time I really don’t see an awful lot in Ox, Gibbs, Theo (although he’s been not that bad over the years, but has fallen into a hole), et al. Ramsey is a bit in between due to his spell earlier in his career and some glimpses of quality here and there, but also questionable due to his inconsistency and Jack, well, I can’t remember him having 10 games in a row where I really thought of him to be great overall. Talented, of course, but a bit stuck in his own idea of how to play on the desired level.
I have hope for the last 3, but wouldn’t mind if some of them (including Theo) were sold straight up to finance someone better.
@Moondoggie not sure if the standard you’re comparing Arsenal to is really that high. We’re doing fine within the league, when it comes to developing players, but would fall quite considerably if it wasn’t ManCity and Chelsea who are used as an example.
In the last 18 months we’ve had Bellerin make it to the first team and regarded as one of the best young RB’s around, Coquelin has made it to the first team (may not be a starter for us but certainly a capable squad option) and then recently Iwobi who was one of the interesting things to come from last season (on the verge of making it).
Wenger may not proactively address the key issues in the squad efficiently enough or be tactically behind the top managers in the game, but I find it surprising that people are having a dig at his ability to bring in youth players now.
EDIT: Would probably have to give Gnabry a mention too, who had a similar sort of contribution in the first team in 13-14 as Iwobi did in the recent season. Been a miserable last couple of seasons for him though mainly due to injury.
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I’ve seen Stones comparisons being bandied about, a pinch of hyperbole maybe however he does look very good on the ball in awkward situations (will often happen at Arsenal). Good in the tackle too.
A very small portion size to judge, nice none the less.
Ramsey, Chambers and Walcott have been some of Wenger’s most expensive signings.
Chambers was our second most expensive player, when we bought him.
It’s a myth we bring through young players regularly.
What we do is buy expensive young players and sometimes they turn out ok.
A bit like the myth we have a young team
We have one of the oldest starting teams in the PL.
After his Euros campaign, I can’t see why anyone still casts doubt on Ramsey. He’s turned into quite the player. If he hadn’t been in a side where he needs to play on the right, he’d probably be a little bit further along in his development.
I agree, he should be playing in his preferred position, but who do we drop to accommodate him?
He is the second best player in the Wales team, where at Arsenal he isn’t even always in the starting line up.
There were some games last season where his finishing and all round play were no where near the quality of a top four team, and I still think if we have everyone fit, he will still struggle to start for us.
It’s not only the academy, but about ‘young’ players imo.We used to (mainly) assemble players from the 18-23 age bracket (Toure, Lauren, Vieira, Henry, Ljungberg, van Persie, Adebayor, Flamini, Clichy etc.) and develop them together and make strong teams out of that. Something which is not happening.
Now we’re just buying average apart from 4-5 players and the young players we did get are going nowhere. It’s just an odd thing in my opinion.
tbf we have a couple of seasons of sample size on Ramsey playing for Arsenal vs 5 games of him playing for Wales. I’d have him perform this way for club first before we come to this conclusion.
Same would go for Giroud too, who has been lauded for his link-up play with Griezmann at the Euros and the idea of how we can get the best out of him vs outright upgrade on his qualities was out there right after the tournament.
we’ll really have to see first.
@SDGooner
it really is and one can hope that they click at some point as a unit as they’re going nowhere at the moment in terms of moving on. At least with how they’re seemingly making an effort of upgrading on current facilities and players there seems to be an idea in place, but it’s for the moment just a project that will take some time to bear fruits.
That was very interesting to read, what surprised me the most is that I thought Southampton might be in there with the amount of talent they’ve produced and shipped out over the last couple of years
Walcott, Bale, Lallana, Shaw, Chambo, Chamberlain just to name a few.
Rob Holding’s transfer from Bolton Wanderers to Arsenal will be completed in the next few days, Sky sources understand.
Edging closer 
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I dont know enough about him so can anyone tell me is he gonna be the answer to our CB problems or is yet another one that might make it in the future?