Mikel Arteta


#622

But that’s not what he said. He said the “consensus” was that Arteta simply wasn’t good enough. There were some of the typical bullshitters that were saying that, but far, far from a consensus.

Arteta’s best season was 12-13, so I don’t think that’s true. As @Calum referred statsbomb and the stats community were basically picking him as the best midfielder in the league that season, and one of the best 6s in the world.


#623

Would you describe it as being “ludicrous”?


#624

Cazorla had 12 goals and 11 assists that season but yeah, Arteta was the best midfielder in the league. Haha. He wasn’t even the best in Arsenal (couldn’t have been as he is shit lol).


#625

I didn’t say he was the best midfielder in the league. He was certainly one of the best, and a very complete 6.

I’m pretty sure you know I’m right but as I’m reacting to ludicrous ( :wink: ) posts from SCRJJ and another mod…


#626

Except you did.


#627

Reading comprehension difficulties anyone…


#628

Arteta joined
Was one of our better players that season and started forming a good partnership with Ramsey

Next season, Arteta was excellent allowing Ramsey to flourish.

Season next Arteta’s fitness started detoriating and if I am not wrong, our DM position was so bad we had to get Flamini in.

Flamini bought his style which for some reason fans dig. For next 6months Flamini was “better”.

Arteta was non entity thereafter as he was always out and when he was available, he was very slow for the role.

My timelines might be wrong but Arteta was never completely shit nor completely excellent.

Fans who said Flamini was better said so because Arteta’s fitness was down at same time and given the option it was better to start Flamini.

In their prime, I would always take Arteta above Flamini.


#629

Why are we discussing Arteta as a player?


#630

Arteta was never very good that’s why he spent the majority of his career playing for Everton and got signed by Arsenal in the same window we bought a whole heap of shit because we sold good players and got mauled 8-2 by Manchester United.

He was a player who was, at his very best, a good player and nothing more. Some of the shit you’re spewing is typical of your posting style to be honest. You can’t accuse me of revisionism because I’m telling you Arteta needed replacing when he played for us and that never changed throughout his entire tenure here.


#631

Of course I can, the statement you made was revisionist history, pure and simple. You yourself I am not accusing of revisionism, that was actually you doing that to me, when the statement you’ve just made above ^ applies perfectly to me, that is, it’s impossible for you to accuse me of revisionism when my stance was exactly the same now as it is then, and I was quite outspoken about it as I am now, and have been always.


#632

The statement I made wasn’t revisionist because I thought Arteta wasn’t good enough then and my opinion on him as a player hasn’t changed now.


#633

It doesn’t matter, your statement was that “the general consensus” was that he wasn’t good enough, that’s revisionism. Your stance doesn’t come into the question, it’s the statement you were trying to use to back up your stance that we’re talking about, and which I pointed out as ironic when you yourself were accusing others of revisionism.


#634

My statement isn’t revisionism. I’m telling you the general consensus on this board was that he wasn’t good enough back then. And stating that now isn’t revisionist.

Unless you’ve got an entirely different definition of the word.


#635

But that’s false…hence why it’s revisionist history. There was always great debate about Arteta but never a general consensus.


#636

It isn’t false. What’s false is you trying to paint the picture that Arteta was some legendary Arsenal number 6 or some number 6 who was among Europe’s elite.

He wasn’t even close.


#637

No, that’s a strawman. I haven’t said he was a legendary number 6 for Arsenal-- saying he was, for a very short period of time, at the level of Gilberto and Petit is quite a different statement–and I didn’t say he was among Europe’s elite, though from 2012-first half of 2013/14 he probably was, or at least very close to being so.

What’s obviously false are basically all your comments here re: Arteta, but you are too stubborn and/or worked up by not getting Allegri to back down from them.


#638

I’m not going to bother searching through the thread, but when the tiniest whisper of the rumour first appear I remember you saying @AbouCuellar that part of you thought it would probably be a bad idea but a bigger part of you were totally keen on the romance of the notion that Arteta would come in as a basque Wengerite and fellow Spaniard to come in and takeover from where Wenger left off.

You have some pretty clear biases in regards to this appointment (him being Spanish, and a Wenger supporter/disciple) and I think you’re just doubling down on all of this revisionism about him being one of our best ever midfielders lol

No offence or anything.


#639

Bollocks, I’ve had this discussion with people who strangely underrate him a million times before, and I’ve also been hyping him as a managerial candidate for a long, long time (I was aggrieved when he went to City).

The Basque stuff is obvious jokes…

The Wengerite thing I have no idea where you’re getting from. If I thought he were a Wengerite in the least I would be strongly against his appointment. I disagree strongly with anyone who suggests that Arteta is in any way a Wenger “disciple”, I think all available evidence would suggest he’s much more a Pep disciple.

The comment you were referring to is that I said I can understand people having doubts about Arteta, and it’s hard for me to argue against them given the dearth of objective evidence to use.

He’s always been the one I wanted, after the unlikely options like Tuchel and Pochettino. You can find a post where I basically listed my options for manager and he was top of the list (maybe tied with Naggelsman?).

Finally, the Spanish stuff has nothing to do with it. It’s no use defending myself because people will come to lazy conclusions like this one regardless but I really don’t have a spanish bias, if anything it’s the opposite. I do like the Basques though, hardy, leathery-skinned people them.


#640

I think he wants a cookie :poldi:


#641

Fair enough.

I always rated Arteta at Arsenal for what it’s worth, and actually think he was a bit misused in our formation by Wenger.

I just don’t understand why your defending the appointment so hard. I’m excited by the idea of him, and wouldn’t be upset about it or anything, but I can’t see how you can defend appointing a guy who’s never managed a game in his life to one of the biggest clubs in Europe that is currently going through a massive restructure and stands on the brink of one of it’s biggest “make or break” moments in its history.

The opportunity cost of Arteta is huge. If we appoint him and he’s massively out of his depth, we miss out on the prime years of Ozil, Mkhi, and Aubameyang and could lose even more influence and power and money if we fall any deeper down the table.

We’ve more or less been able to survive these two seasons out of the Top 4 based on Wenger’s name and presence as well as our cash reserves but if we sign a high risk, no experience young manager who fucks it up it can cost us a shit ton not only in terms of capital but also reputation and the way other managers and players will look at our board and how the club is run and question how serious we are as a club.

I like Arteta, I think he’ll surprise people, but fuck me if this isn’t a crazy Hail Mary move.