Yeah, that’s the thing, Guardiola has a “philosophy” that’s proven to work and that he has been able to carry out brilliantly. Wenger has a much less clear philosophy, that gets very muddy in certain areas, that hasn’t produced a significant title in 13 years. I was glad to defend Wenger for not adapting his philosophy when I still believe he really had a defined one/he could make it work with less financial restrictions. But alas…
Fuck pepe lets justy win eh ?
@SRCJJ was the one that brought up the philosophy, so if you are looking for clarification on what that is, he would probably be the one to ask no? My answer was (or so i thought anyway) a little tongue in cheek.
I will however attempt to answer you so bear with me
Pep is used to having a 10/10 squad that can play open, expansive football,using players that are vastly superior to 95% of their opponents. At Man City he doesn’t have that luxury, yet is still playing as if he does.
With regards to losing his best defender and captain, i assume you mean Kompany? He hasn’t really had a standout season since 10/11, if anything he was a liability at times during the 14/15 season. Guardiola would have been well aware of this prior to the move, and had more than enough time to determine that he needed a new 1st team defender. So i am sorry but I disagree with everything you mentioned regarding that.
Guardiola spent almost £200m in the summer according to Transfermarkt, and while you of course have to allow some time for adjustments of new systems, managers, players etc etc, you would expect a manager of Guardiola’s calibur to adjust the the tactics to suit the players available. Or to have made the right signings to suit said philosophy.
He hasn’t done that effectively, so i don’t see why it’s not fair to acknowledge that particular result, and their season as a whole as an opportunity where they could, and should have done better.
Conte has done just as big a job with an arguably more broken team in Chelsea tbh.
Can we just fuck the philosphy thing off. Its so fucking pretentious.
Its just football. Tactics, outlook way of playing maybe but thats all it is.
I think his squad has already shown several times this season, that they can play “open, expansive football” with some convincing displays. They lead the league in possession, passing accuracy and are only second behind Liverpool in shots taken. The capabilities and the framework are there, but they will have to find consistency.
While I’m not a big fan, Kompany can still be a good defender. We can only speculate as to why Guardiola did not sell him, but I think replacing both the keeper and the entire central defense (including the captain) in your first season is something hardly any manager would dare to do, especially one who’s already expected to win trophys from the get go.
But he did. He signed a proven world class player in de Bruyne (surely his transfer, even a year prior), basically the same with Gündogan (both creative midfielders with exceptional passing ability), bought Sané for the wing, who is very good in one on one situations, something crucial to attacking teams, and he bought a highly rated, ball-playing centre back for build up play. He also brought in a keeper who’s comfortable on the ball and two more highly rated attacking talents. Can’t buy more suited to his style of play than that.
Of those transfers, Sané and Stones have not lived up to their fee yet, but they are also very young and have a high ceiling. Bravo has been a disappointment, but that is something you can hardly blame the manager for.
We’ll see how things are in spring/summer. If City continue to concede as many goals as they do now, Guardiola will rightfully have to answer some questions on his transfer activities. As for the comparison with Chelsea: Conte has a squad of senior players that hasn’t changed much at all over the years (even David Luiz just “returned”) and can focus on the league entirely, while City had the hardest grp in the CL. That surely is an advantage. Nevertheless, he’s done pretty well so far.
I’m not convinced. Which doesn’t mean I think he isn’t the best, he might very well be, just that he hasn’t shown it yet. Pep’s clearly won a bucket of trophies, but lets look at the period before, under and after Pep at Barca (La Liga + CL results):
the 4 year period prior to Pep: 1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd + 1 CL win
the 4 year period under Pep: 3rd, 1st, 1st, 1st, + 2 CL wins
the 4 year period after Pep: 1st, 2nd, 1st, 1st + 1 CL win
Better with Pep? yes, CL must rank higher than La Liga. Significantly? debatable. Did he fix a broken Barca at the time or was it more about replacing a fallen Ronaldinho with the best player in the world who just excelled at the Copa (2007) and the Olympics (2008) + Xavi-Iniesta combo? could be down to all kinds of things, the motions of other top clubs in Europe etc. Difficult to tell. Does this mean that Rijkaard and Enrique are close to as good as Pep? Apparently, they got nearly the same result with slightly worse squads, but probably not.
Comparing his time at Bayern (Before and under, since there’s no after yet):
the 3 year period before Pep: 1st, 3rd, 2nd, + 1 CL win + 1 CL Runners up
the 3 year period with Pep: 1st, 1st, 1st + - (not even reaching the finals once)
Better with Pep? In the league - yes, Dortmund peaked (with Klopp emerging) during Heynckes period and reached the CL finals (that they lost to Bayern), they were the 2nd best team in Europe if you will and they won the league over Bayern before Pep joined. Enter Pep and Bayern didn’t even reach the CL finals once and CL must rank higher than the league, however Dortmund declined, transfered big Lewa to Bayern etc so the only threat to the league subsided.
So he won buckets but not significantly more than his predecessors/successors. Which means it is impossible to deny that he is at least pretty good, but it is far from proof that he is the best imo. Mou, Klopp, Simeone etc did more with less at some point, so the only way for Pep to prove he is above them is to… well do the same I think. Again, not saying this proves he isn’t the best, it just doesn’t prove he is.
Now he took City in the prem, yet again the team with the best and most expensive squad and bulked on another £150m net in players, (for reference that is bang on as much as we’ve spent on Sanchez, Özil, Mustafi, Xhaka and Cech). He -should- win the league comfortably one could say. Anything else is a disaster. And if he wins it narrowly I’d say it was the expected result with that squad and again it shows that he is at least pretty good but doesn’t prove he is the best, to me at least.
Takes quite some time to coach the kind of defensive pressure that’s necessary to have if you want to play that kind of football. They’re on the right track though. They force the most long balls in the league, they manage to disrupt the opposition’s passing more than all the other teams and they concede very few chances. But you can still see that, at the moment, as soon as they come up against good teams, they look really vulnerable.
Probably not the best, to ask your defenders to then play offside that high up and to commit that many players forward unless your pressing really can cope with that. Maybe towards the end of this season or next season, we’ll see them dominate top teams too.
They can still very much win the title though. No real crisis here or anything, IMO.
Their summer transfer window wasn’t very good though. Too many attacking players in the squad, yet they still signed even more and spent 50m on a crap defender when they probably could have signed two good defenders for that price.
Sané or a similar winger with dribbling ability was necessary though, and Nolito was so cheap so I suppose there’s really nothing wrong but IMO, the midfield and the defense was more important. If you have to make a decision between upgrading either the midfield and defense properly, or upgrade on the attackers, then it would have been better to go with the former. Fernandinho, who is already quite old, was their only holding midfielder. Ridiculous to not sign another one in case he’d end up injured/suspended.
They also probably should have kept Nasri
Apply cold water to that burn
There’s no doubt that Pep has vastly underestimated the PL by badly neglecting the defence, he thought bringing John Stones in would be sufficient on the defensive front? A young CB still learning his trade? No way.
Plus they need at least two new fullbacks if not one since Zabaleta, Kolorov and Clichy are all not good enough. They also need another bonafide CB since Kompany is done fitness-wise.
Some of the “defending” they’re doing as of late is pure Disneyland stuff.
Whaaat. Is this for real. I guess more of City’s poor matches have been outside the Prem.
Well they lost to Tottenham, Chelsea and Leciester, they went on a 6-game streak without a win etc. However City had a CL group on the side and United had some lolteams in Europa league, I know Feyenoord but not the rest.
I’m finding it quite interesting how before the season started both Pep and Mourinho were tipped to be the showpiece clash of English football this season but to an extent they have both been outshone by Conte and Klopp.
Cruciate ligament it seems, 2nd or 3rd big injury of his career.
Damn sucks I hate to see that.
Great player, I hope he recovers.
Was always going to the big issue with signing him, but I suppose it was a no brainer at only 20m, when at his best he would be the most complete midfielder in the league. Shame.