As a democratic socialist I really don’t need to be told the part in bold I suppose I feel that kind of strengthens my position, the position I am taking about how football should remain affordable for all is one that I apply to most facets of life and our society, including things that are far more important to people’s well being and day to day life.
Basically I don’t think that “capitalism causes more serious problems than people not being able to go to football” is a sentence even worth saying, because it is so blindingly obvious that I don’t think an one would disagree or not be aware of that fact. It’s a bit like when there are articles, protests or social media campaigns about an social/politocal/environmental issue and people say “there are far bigger issues that you should be concerned with instead of this, why are you talking about this”, missing the obvious fact that people can be concerned about more than one issue at a time, or that support for different causes are not mutually exclusive. If there’s a series of articles about women facing sexual harassment in the work place you’ll always get some man saying “why are we even discussing this when there are bigger issues we should be tackling” as if there is only time to be concerned about on issue at a time, as if being concerned with sexual harassment in the workplace means a person isn’t concerned about other issues. I see yours and shevchenko’s point in the same light. Yes there are bigger issues caused by capitalism than this but hat doesn’t mean we have to just shut up about it until all of the more serious issues in the world are resolved.
In particular because it clearly doesn’t have to be this way. This could quite easily be fixed by the powers hat be, all we really have to do is look over at Germany.
They don’t even have tv deals comparable to the one we have, which means that matchday revenues are a much less significant part of our revenues than they once we’re in years gone by. The quote and Germany generally shows that astronomical tickets prices are not just a fact of life that you and sevchenko say we must accept. We shouldn’t just accept it, people should keep talking about it and campaigning, and things may change.
As for saying people should just support a different team, I can’t get my head around that. You don’t change teams full stop, that’s it. Maybe because you are abroad and probably chose to support Arsenal for a set of logical and defined reasons you think that there can be logical reasons for deciding to support a different football club, but that’s not how I view fandom.
I will pay more attention to Bayern CEO when they have couple of oil clubs(Wolfsburg ain’t Chelsea, PSG, City) breathing down their neck, making it hard for Bayern to gather up all quality German players within the league.
If they keep their ticket price low even after that, I shall admire them then. (I do admire them though).
I supported Arsenal beause they were relatively local, the weren’t the closest club, but they were within 10 miles of my home address at the time, (1971). When I was a season ticket holder 1973 onwards, I would guess that for most of the early years, 90 % of the home support came from a relatively local fanbase, this is also the reason that local lads who go on to play for the club are most loved, usually.
Even big clubs like us and Man Utd, Liverpool and the rest had local fans, these were the main basis of supporters, it was only when the money came in that clubs became more national, then global, and local support was not as important as it once was…
People came from all over, and they are willing to pay silly money.
If I could, I would go to every game, I love being at the game, you cannot beat the match day experience, however as I and my family have grown, other things become more important than football, like kids, schooling, holidays, etc etc…
Im not moaning because I cant afford to go, Im just pointing out that sometimes you have to get your priorities right…
Respect the other nineteen clubs in the division who also don’t rip off their fans but have to worry about the giant that is Bayern coming along and stealing their best because they are more successful and have more money.
Yea, I get that. It was more of a general statement made by me more than it was directly aimed at you.
They do also keep it down for the common fan, because they can do so and in exchange will charge higher prices at VIP level. If they wanted to they could easily charge more.
So as I said above, what about the other seventeen* (@SRCJJ) clubs in the division? The prices Bayern charge are evidently part of a wider trend and not just a result of them not having an oil club to compete with, meaning that the quote from Hoeness is perfectly valid as representing the difference in attitudes in Germany and England, which was my point.
The point about supporting a different team is really a rhetorical one: I’m not actually suggesting you support another team, but rather realise that this is part and parcel of supporting a massive club. There’s loads of people out in the world supporting lower clubs, we have the luck of supporting a big club, even if it’s a frustrating big club in the grand scheme of things. I think you have to accept the consequences that come with that. Sure, Bayern, stands as an exception, German football in general, but let’s face it, there’s not a single example in Spain or England (the latter of course more relevant), of teams charging less than supply and demand dictates. These are big businesses, so if they don’t choose to be the one exception among these big businesses and make a very generous gesture to their clientele, as in the case of Bayern, and instead just act as big businesses do, well then you can’t exactly be surprised.
Trust me I didn’t choose to support Arsenal for any logical set of reasons…I started supporting them before I could possibly come up with a plausible set of ‘logical and defined reasons’. If I had I would’ve chosen Madrid and be supporting the biggest club in the world and able to attend the games whenever I wanted.
I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said in the first paragraph but it doesn’t change my point, and I think sevchenko’s point, that it is hard to stomach at some times. I don’t see big campaigns going on from filmgoers about the fact tickets to the cinema have risen over the last 20 years, or from theatre goers, etc. In the end we’re talking about a leisure time activity and the indignation that you see go with some of the complaints does not reflect that.
@PPB no doubt, homie, which is why I turned down free, premium tickets to an Arsenal match last spring (not exactly free, considering it entails a flight and hotel stay). I didn’t have interest in making an effort to watch Arsenal when the product on the field didn’t reward the effort/money it would require to go. Don’t see why it should be any different for someone in London. There are people out there willing to pay that price–hence why the price is what it is in the first place, because the demand meets the supply–so sell your tickets if you see that the product on the pitch doesn’t match the price.
PRODUCT ??? Not a good word to use but I understand that spring feeling . I didnt go in to the Swansea match even after being offerred a freebie on the Holloway road 1 Hour before kick off (i had sold mine) . Instead me and a friend got pissed in the pub and watched people rip their hair out when they got back from the match !
This is how we do it in America Shammy, go for the party and the atmosphere, what we call “tailgating” at American football. Use the money you would have spent on a ticket to buy some drinks for new friends.
I lived in the USA love the sports . Ice hockey has the nearest atmosphere . NY Jets tailgates were awesome .Yankee stadium was a hoot too.but the Rangers in the garden was fantastic !
I’ve always thought that loan moves are a good option for younger players that struggle for playing time and need somewhere, relatively risk free for both clubs, to develop.
I suppose I feel that kind of strengthens my position, the position I am taking about how football should remain affordable for all is one that I apply to most facets of life and our society, including things that are far more important to people’s well being and day to day life.
) clubs in the division? The prices Bayern charge are evidently part of a wider trend and not just a result of them not having an oil club to compete with, meaning that the quote from Hoeness is perfectly valid as representing the difference in attitudes in Germany and England, which was my point.