Brexit - The UK decision to leave the European Union


#203

Well you’re getting the ability to sign new trade deals with new countries, which is what the whole thing is about.

You don’t pay O2 £200 to get out of your contract for fun, you do it so you can go to another provider.

Again, £50bn is pennies in the grand scheme of things really. The UK could make that up in a couple of years if they actually decided to follow through on taxing corporations like Apple, Starbucks, Google, Amazon etc. properly.


#204

Is that what the whole thing is about? Because I think that’s a stretch if you claim that that is the overriding reason for people voting Brexit. There were a wide range of reasons and in yet to see reliable polling stating that that is what Brexit is all about.

I’m yet to see much indication of these exciting new trade deals we’re going to negotiate, but I guess I’ll sit tight and wait to see if that transpires. But besides that, I thought that the EU and countries within it constitutes our biggest export market, they won’t be giving us a better trade deal than we had when we were in the EU, will they?


#205

50bn is a steal compared to what the Irish people have put into (mostly) European banks over a shorter time frame.


#206

Huge if true. DUP won’t be happy and would probably vote against it.


#207

Cancel Brexit


#208

None of this really makes sense if the EU doesn’t want to talk future until we stump up some cash.

The jist I’m getting we need to first agree how we’ll implement a hard Brexit (the “divorce”) before we can even talk about implementing any kind of soft Brexit?

My current feeling is they hold the power in these negotiations and while we’ve tried to stand tall we’re going to end up begging at some stage.

In the grand scheme of the EU I’m sure they’re perfectly happy to allow the Irish to be pissed off about their border or at least allow the threat of that happening to linger.


#209

We’ve already broadly speaking come to an agreement with the EU on what the “divorce” bill will be, and it dosnt need stumping up now its just a recognition from us to settle liabilities up to 30 years from now.

The other two key areas which we must agree before we “talk future” are the Irish border and EU nationals rights.

EU rights is relatively easy to compromise on and agree.

The Irish border is virtually impossible to agree without pissing at least one group of people of in a big way. This is now he key sticking point stoping us from moving onto trade deals, transition periods and future arrangements.


#210

But surely it could also come under the umbrella of stuff to be sorted out as part of trade deals and future arrangements? Maybe I’m completely misreading the vibe but it feels like we’re having to basically agree to create an Irish border before we can move onto future talks which could potentially involve the removal of an Irish border (if that makes any sense at all)?

Does the EU even have any control of borders with non-EU countries? As far as I know we had control of our own non-EU immigration policy but I don’t know how that related to physical borders (I assumed that Schengen had something like that but Ireland aren’t part of that either). Like could we have a migration agreement with Ireland that we basically don’t give a fuck about who crosses the border, and then a separate deal with the EU in regards to some customs union for goods etc. crossing?


#211

This isn’t about immigration or trade.

If you have a physical boarder in Ireland that means a manned operation and that in all likelihood means someone, somewhere, taking a shot at and killing boarder guards on either/both sides. And that could mean a crack in a already fragile peace process that is already creaking due to the lack of a NI government for almost a year now.

A physical boarder needs to be avoided and the DUP are concerned that if that is done by leaving trade conditions in place it is the start of a (in their eyes) slippery slope to a united Ireland.

The complications of the North alone should have been reason enough that Brexit was never even remotely a possibility…


#212

#213

She’s like a child. “I want one too!!”

I’d also imagine Scotland getting such a deal would significantly reduce the independence argument so ultimately I’m not sure why she’d promote this.


#214

The case for N.Ireland is completely different too. Unless she wants the same problem with the Scottish and English border (she probably does to be fair :laughing:)


#215

Sounds like a cracking idea


#216

I think we’re getting ever closer to a united Ireland, which is good imo. Although it’s still probably a few years off.


#217

You’ve completely misrepresented my post in how you’ve quoted what I said there. I’m sure it wasn’t intentional but I wouldn’t want a passer by to see those few words out of context and attach that sentiment to me. I am neutral on the idea of a united Ireland. If that is to be the will of the island at some point in the future that’s fine and if not that’s fine too.


#218

#219

I haven’t at all to be honest. I haven’t given the impression that you think it would be a good idea, I’ve simply highlighted your mention of a united Ireland and then given an opinion on that, an opinion that stands alone from what was said in your post.

I don’t think that that snippet from your post gives any sort of impression of your opinion on the matter.


#220

I disagree and said I didn’t think you’d done so intentionally but I think someone could easily read the tiny part of the post you quoted and make an assumption. So I was just making my position clear.


#221

And independent Scotland as well I hope.

DUP calling the shots, scuppered this Brexit deal.

Ruth Davidson nowhere to be seen but has come out today defending the DUP :arteta:

All’s quiet on the Labour front. Cheers for that great opposition.


#222

I think I’ve highlighted the part of your post that merely mentions a united Ireland and then expressed my opinion, I don’t think that snippet of your post makes it sound like you have an opinion on it either way. I think that to the extent that I am not actually sure if you are accusing me of making it look like you are in favour of a united Ireland or opposed to it.

I think anyone who assumes your position from those six words would be an idiot and bot even worth your concern anyway.

But I accept that you feel differently, and I regret that as you never want to misrepresent someone or at least make them feel like they have been. You are right that that wasnt my intention, clearly, as I still don’t even accept that I’ve done it haha.

Don’t want to argue about it though (as I’m sure you don’t), I’ll try to think more about it before partially quoting you in future. Would it have been better if I had quoted he whole post or paragraph and made the words “united Ireland” bold?